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Add Dion Waiters, Josh Smith to the Celtics rumor mill

Chuck - Red's Army February 11, 2014 Avery Bradley, Jeff Green, Rumors 64 Comments

dion

With the trade deadline fast approaching, we can expect a significant increase in the number of Celtics trade rumors. As always, we’ll do our best to bring them all to you.

Grantland’s Zach Lowe throws out a new name – Dion Waiters:

Dion Waiters falls at the intersection of all this. Warts and all, the guy has obvious NBA skills, and smart “buy low” talent evaluators recognize that. Boston has kicked around almost every intriguing “buy low” piece in the league, especially guys on rookie deals. The Celtics have an appetite for low-cost risk on high-upside talent, even talent with “attitude” issues, but Waiters might be too far down the road for Boston at this point. But if the Cavs can find a decent future first-rounder for Waiters, they have to think about it.

A report earlier this month gives details on why “Waiters might be too far down the road for Boston:”

One league source, speaking on condition of anonymity, confirmed Waiters was removed from practice recently, per the Daily News report. But Waiters’ minutes weren’t affected by the move, which left at least a handful of players raising their eyebrows — particularly within an organization that has preached accountability since Brown’s arrival.

“That’s Dion. He’s been like that since he got here. He doesn’t think anything is his fault,” one team source said. “He’s actually better about it this year than he was last year.”

Yikes. Not sure I want that type of attitude in Boston, especially if it comes at the expense of Avery Bradley. I’m not saying there will be a straight swap, but acquiring Waiters means there’s no future here for AB.

Brent Barry of NBA TV hinted at a possible Jeff Green for Josh Smith trade.

No thanks.

The NBA’s worst shooter and his $13.5 million salary can stay in Detroit.

And Sam Amico of Fox Ohio reports the Celtics might stick with Rajon Rondo, Jared Sullinger and Jeff Green as their core:

Most executives contacted by FOX Sports Ohio say it seems more and more likely that Ainge and coach Brad Stevens want to build around point guard Rajon Rondo, forward Jeff Green and second-year big man Jared Sullinger, the reigning Eastern Conference Player of the Week.

Everyone else, however, appears to be available. (And even those three aren’t considered untouchable.)

Outside of Rondo, Green and Sullinger, forward Brandon Bass and guard Avery Bradley are drawing the most interest. The same goes for backup forward Kris Humphries, whose $12 million contract is set to expire.

I don’t see Green as a core guy. Keep Bradley, shop Green.

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  • http://www.thegainescollective.com/ Kendra Gaines

    Why do people see AB as a core guy? I think he’s easily replaceable, and I think if a team has the RR, JS, JG core, they obviously have to run and be athletic.

    • Curt Hays

      Because the NBA is about matchups. AB can shut down the likes of Kobe and Dwade.

      • tvor03

        You mean those two guys who are on their last legs?

        • Curt Hays

          Shall I list every shooting guard in the league, or was my point clear enough in the first place?

          • tvor03

            The 2-guard position is at it’s weakest it’s been in decades. Apart from Harden, there isn’t a real threat from that spot anymore. The game is currently centered around PGs and forwards.

            I like Avery. But he’s injury prone, and his offense is just as inconsistent as Green’s. His strength is his defense, and he happens to guard a position that has very little threat from other teams.

          • Curt Hays

            Valid points about AB. But if the SG spot is so weak, then maybe he is sufficient. :-)

            Is neither Monta Ellis nor Stephen Curry better than Harden?

          • tvor03

            Stephen is a PG. And Monta, though better this year, is an extremely inefficient player. I don’t think we should sign a player on the off-chance we see Monta Ellis in the finals.

          • Curt Hays

            So then you don’t care to sign anyone to stop Monta or Harden. Then what’s wrong with keeping Avery Bradley?

          • tvor03

            Bradley’s great if you need someone to stop those guys. But I don’t think we do. I want someone better than Bradley. A more consistent shooter, and someone taller, at the two would be great. But what I think this team really needs is a big man who can compete against Bosh and Hibbert. If we can get that and keep AB, than great. That’s best case scenario. But if we have to give something up to gain that big man, I believe AB is the most expendable.

          • Curt Hays

            I agree. I offered a similar scenario in response to GreenbirdCro.

        • http://www.thegainescollective.com/ Kendra Gaines

          Lol

      • http://www.thegainescollective.com/ Kendra Gaines

        Yea but what about what John Wall did to him. Irving? Felton in the playoffs?

        Idk why, but it seems people wildly overrate our guards and wildly underrate our front court.

        With a real rim protector and an athletic SG with some size, that core could make some noise. I believe this is now a young man’s league. Athletes win.

        • Curt Hays

          Individual defense doesn’t always reflect a player’s impact. Look at KPerk or KG. I’m still not fully disagreeing regarding AB, but I don’t think the dats show it to be a young man’s game. Spurs, Mavs, Miami.

          • LA Flake

            Russell Westbrook has nightmares about AB, too.

        • LA Flake

          John Wall and Kyrie Irving make a lot of people look bad. But instead of having a soft dude checking guys like them, I feel confident throwing AB at’em. He’s hands down the best defender at his position in the league.

    • Curt Hays

      I’m not disagreeing though. We still need Tyson Chandler. JG just may not be worth it.

      • LA Flake

        Tyson Chandler would be amazing next to Sully but he’s too injury prone. And isn’t he past his prime?

        • Curt Hays

          Only about as far past it as KG was in 2009. Tyson was a key factor in the Mavs’ title. I think he is the current FG% leader in the league…meaning that you know he’ll score. He got like $18M from NYK. He’ll be far cheaper than that now.

    • chuckmckenney

      AB has value. He’s not a top 3 guy, but he can fill a big role on this team – jump shooter and defender.

      • http://www.thegainescollective.com/ Kendra Gaines

        I just think he’s replaceable and should be for a cheaper, more athletic guy.

        • Curt Hays

          Name one and maybe it could be a compelling idea.

          • http://www.thegainescollective.com/ Kendra Gaines

            Dion Waiters lol

          • Curt Hays

            That’s a terrible idea! hahaha
            Any good ideas?

          • http://www.thegainescollective.com/ Kendra Gaines

            But is AB worth 8m?

          • Curt Hays

            That’s a better question. I’ve never had $8M, and if I did…I’d be spending it on myself. So I have no idea. :-)

          • http://www.thegainescollective.com/ Kendra Gaines

            Comparable stats

          • Curt Hays

            But the stats don’t show the intangibles. This article talks about Waiters being kicked out of practice. Luol Deng is losing his mind because of how poorly Cleveland is managed. Dion Waiters is bad for the locker room. Avery Bradley has proven to be able to win games with his team and not cause fighting in the locker room (metaphor).

      • Rjd12345

        I love AB, but dude needs to stop chucking. He has taken the “no pass” mantra from Bass

  • GreenbirdCro

    We need a top gun type of player. Not many of those lying around. We can hope to get lucky come draft day, but even then it could take a while till even the greatest prospect blossoms. Not so sure we have that much time. All in all, maybe we should make a big risk and call me crazy but I don’t see anyone else worthy of it then one Carmelo Anthony. And I think we have pieces to do it as well as the Knicks may just have a need to get it done. There, I said it.

    • Curt Hays

      Carmelo will not lead the team to glory. He doesn’t comprehend Celtic culture.

      • GreenbirdCro

        It will be his undoing. Should he not realise that and adapt accordingly. His legacy would be of a looser. I call that a reasonable motivation. Besides, I never thought of a #20 more then just a sharpshooter/scorer. But history just may consider him a champ…

        • Curt Hays

          It would be amazing to see Carmelo grow up and be deserving of a championship. He MIGHT be worth a risk. I don’t think he’s worth a $20M risk though.
          Ray Allen played hard on defense, he was the first guy in the gym every single day. Not some. Every day. Doc Rivers shot himself in the foot by forcing the ball to Pierce at the end of every game. That’s why he was never open anymore. I still think Ray left because of his wife, but I know he was mad that he didn’t get the ball more. He could drive as well as anyone in the league (LeBron doesn’t count in any comparison). In 2008, Rondo still often considered Ray the 1st option in the last 5 seconds of the game. Idk when that changed. Ray did nothing to not earn consideration as a Celtic. Not saying they should retire his jersey in Boston.

          • LA Flake

            The ball often found Ray for our final shot and the guy delivering the ball was usually Paul Pierce. Ray Allen said as much when he broke Reggie Miller’s record for most 3 pointers made. And Doc never put the ball in Rondo’s hands for the final shot because, well, that would’ve been just plain stupid.

            The reason why Ray was upset with Rondo was because he wouldn’t pass him the ball during the first 47 minutes. I think it was Redsarmy’s own John (or Chuck) who once blogged about how we won most of our games when Ray shot more than xx amount of times. But Ray never got the touches he deserved because Rondo just couldn’t handle Ray’s criticism of his decision-making and shooting. At least that’s what Donny Marshall said and we all know how close he is with Ray Allen.

            Oh yeah…EFF you, Ray Allen!

          • Curt Hays

            Not being facetious.
            Thank you for that. I really hadn’t heard it that way before. I’d heard Rondo say that Ray is the guy to pass it to. I didn’t really think Rondo was to blame. I’m not sure if you’re being serious about Marshall and Ray being close. I don’t live there, but it seems like you’re being serious. Rondo and Ray had lockers next to one another as late as 2011, so I didn’t think they had big issues for real.
            I still blame Doc for more than I do anyone else…well except for Joey Crawford.

          • LA Flake

            I know as much as you do about these things. But I do know that Rondo and Ray were EXTREMELY CLOSE at first because Ray made sure Rondo was the first person he reached out to when he was traded here. Ray always talked about how he and Rondo needed to be on the same page as backcourt mates. And you heard through their own mouths about how Rondo likes to go to Ray’s house before or after big games to focus, discuss, etc, etc. Their relationship, as I understand it, started out beautifully. Then something happened over the years and Donny Marshall started hinting about Ray being unhappy with Rondo’s decision-making, his shot not improving, etc. Then, we read and heard it was Rondo who went to Doc and suggested Ray be benched in favor of AB because AB was kicking his butt in practice. It all went downhill from there.

            Now, this is all just me regurgitating what I heard and read from Ray and Rondo through the media as well as the likes of Marshall, Tanguay, etc. So, it’s probably not 100% accurate but I’m pretty sure it’s not far from the truth.

            As for Donny Marshall and Ray being close, their relationship goes back to their days at UConn and Marshall served as an unofficial mouthpiece for Ray’s camp while they were here.

            Bottom line: Ray was never upset about Paul taking the final shot. Putting the ball in Paul’s hands was the right call because he was our best 1 on 1 guy and you could trust him to get a good shot off or draw the defense and find an open teammate. You may remember the missed shots more because they hurt so much but he also made those big shots and made the right passes much more during his storied career here. Between 2000-2007, Pierce was one of the most dominant players the league has ever seen at his position. Especially when you consider all the guys who *spaced* the floor for Pierce during those years.

      • GreenbirdCro

        Any better idea? I honestly would love better one. But remember, top tier scorer

        • Curt Hays

          Did you ever see Moneyball? Remember how Jason Giambi was replaced? It wasn’t done with one guy. Don’t spend your money on one guy. That’s just asking for him to get injured and ruin your season. We were still competitive even when KG went down (please don’t talk about that season, I’ll cry).

          Get Tyson Chandler/Greg Monroe/Andre Drummond to start with. That would give Sully a lot of room to shine. He’d be your first option. You’d get all the rebounds. Trade Brandon Bass and Jeff Green for him if you feel like it.

          Pick up Gordon Hayward/Kidd-Gilchrist/Chandler Parsons (my choice is Parsons) and then you’ve saved some money and stretched the floor.

          Point is, don’t just look for one guy. It didn’t work for any other teams in history, why would it work now?

          • Curt Hays

            @tvor03:disqus Here.

          • GreenbirdCro

            Chris, I couldn’t agree more with you that we need to find more pieces and not put all our eggs (hopes) in one basket. Also, I would love we get either Greg or Andre (although can’t see Detroit letting him go). Tyson is simply too old. All these other kids are fine but don’t make me drool.

          • Curt Hays

            I’d upvote you, but my name is Curt! Haha.

          • GreenbirdCro

            Geez
            whata mistakea to makea
            corrected
            my sincere apologies
            upvote?! :)

        • LA Flake

          Jabari’s walking through that door this June. BELIEEEEEEEVE!!!

          • Curt Hays

            Play sorry for Jabrari!

          • LA Flake

            Then party hardy with Jabari!

          • GreenbirdCro

            That sounds great. However, trades seem less sci-fi to me atm
            lol ;)

        • Rjd12345

          Wait it out. We aren’t winning this year. Hopefully there’s good moves to be made at the draft but it’s not smart to make a move out of haste.

          • GreenbirdCro

            Rjd, why not indeed. But the point is, what or rather who should we wait (target) for? That’s what I’m asking. Who can help us get No.18? I don’t think we’ll win it next year either

  • swissflix

    If Bass gets traded (and i do hope so for a mid first round pick), then i wish him nothing but the best. Hopefully he gets sent to a good team. True professional, has never caused any problems. Seems to be a great person.

    • Curt Hays

      He’s also a good rapper. :-)

    • CFH

      And the new team has to promise he’ll keep practicing his swimming. :)

    • swissflix

      Although his fumbles do drive me crazy

  • Brad P

    It’d be cool to get Klay Thompson somehow. Bradley and a pick for him would be nice, even though that’s still a long shot.

    • Curt Hays

      Then we’d have two players who have dad’s that are heavily involved in team affairs.

  • Frank Aziza

    Get rid of Bradley and Green. Bradley is undersized and shoots like he thinks he’s in Ray Allen’s league.

    • LA Flake

      3 years later, when our guards are being eaten alive by AB, we’ll all ask, “Why don’t we have a defender like that on our team?”

      • Curt Hays

        ^All the upvotes.

      • Curt Hays

        Flake, just wanted to make sure that you saw you got 20 upvotes here.

  • eddysamson

    Josh Smith is one odd dude. I have him on my fantasy team and apart from one stretch where I just HAD to sit him, he’s been fine. In his last 4 games, 3 of them were for 20-30 pts shooting .500-.560 or so. He also tends to fill the sheet with boards, assists, steals, and blocks. But he also has that tendency to shoot whenever he feels like it from wherever.

    I don’t think the trade rumors for him will go away until Rondo is no longer a Celtic. But who knows, maybe he would become a better and more efficient player with Rondo.

    • LA Flake

      He’s not odd. He’s just a dumb player. He’s like a more athletic version of Antoine Walker and well, that’s about it.

      • Brad P

        Holy crap, I kind of like that comparison. Except Walker has actually made some All-Star teams

  • Brad

    I would much rather keep Bradley than Green. Bradley does something extremely well, and does it consistently. Green does a lot of things pretty well, but only about once every week or two.

    Also, if Brandon Bass has to be traded, I hope the C’s can hook him up with a winning team like they did Perk & tried to do for Pierce & KG. I’ve been a C’s fan since ’96, and I would definitely rank Bass as one of my top 10 favorite non-All Star level Celtics. The dude deserves a championship somewhere.

  • Celtic bro

    How about a package of bradley and bass for klay thompson. The warriors can do this with their trade exception.

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