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Danny Ainge just ruined Ray Allen’s day

Chuck - Red's Army January 30, 2014 Danny Ainge, Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Ray Allen 69 Comments

NBA Finals Game 4: Los Angeles Lakers v Boston Celtics

During his weekly appearance on Toucher and Rich Danny Ainge commented on the likelihood of the Celtics retiring the jersey numbers of Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen:

Celtics President of Basketball Ops. Danny Ainge wasn’t present when the team honored Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett on Sunday, but said both players will likely be joining the 22 other Celtics greats whose number hangs in the Garden rafters.

Pierce’s #34 and Garnett’s #5 will, at some point, be retired with the rest of the best, cementing their legacies with the franchise.

Ray Allen on the other hand?

“I’m not sure yet. I don’t know the answer to that,” Ainge told 98.5 The Sports Hub’s Toucher & Rich on Thursday.

Ainge said the decision to retire a player’s number will come down to the C’s ownership group. He did admit that the way things ended with Allen, with the sharpshooter taking less money from Boston’s chief rival at the time, the Miami Heat, will likely play a role in that decision.

“I think that’s obviously somewhat of a factor. But I think time heals those hurts, and logic will take over,” said Ainge. “The question is did he play long enough and that kind of thing? There are a lot of great Celtics in history, and Ray Allen is certainly one of them. I know there will be consideration and discussion about that happening. We’ll see.”

Ainge is right. Time does heal all wounds. Even a vindictive bastard like myself will soften on Ray Allen.

But… will we soften up enough to the point where #20 gets hoisted into the rafters?

Danny also mentioned time spent in Boston. Ray played 5 seasons here, only one fewer than Kevin Garnett. Is that one season the tipping point?

Without Garnett, there is no championship. Period. If we substitute a good shooting guard for Ray Allen, does Boston win a title? I think it’s possible.

Of course, one could argue that KG never would have agreed to a trade here if not for the acquisition of Allen.

This is certain, Ray Allen will learn of Ainge’s comments and it will piss him off. Because if there’s one thing we learned about Ray during his time here, it’s that the small stuff gets to him.

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  • eddysamson

    Hell no I don’t want Ray Allen’s # retired!

  • Curt Hays

    I don’t know whether they SHOULD retire his jersey…but I love Ray Allen’s game and his work ethic. I hate what he did, but I still cheer for him. If his jersey is retired, I will be very happy for him.

    • Tommy_Heinsohn

      Curt, I respect you as a legitimate commenter on this site but you have to be kidding me. Do you really think anyone who has had their number raised to the rafters would pull the same BS that Ray pulled? Would Havlicek, Bird, Cousy, Russell, Pierce, etc. ever betray the Celtics and the city of Boston by signing to their rivals for less money immediately after losing the ECF to that team? Absolutely not. I couldn’t even imagine Waltah or Scalabrine doing that. Ray Allen, does NOT deserve to have his number retired. I love him as an NBA player. I love his work ethic, and in my opinion he is the greatest shooter of all time… but does he deserve to have his number retired as a Celtic? HELL NO!

      • Curt Hays

        You forgot to list Tommy Heinsohn! Haha.

        You do make a compelling argument. Because of you guys here, I will refrain from arguing FOR retiring his number. But I will still cheer for the guy as long as Miami loses. Granted, it is getting tougher and tougher to cheer for him…

  • Danno

    Kevin and Paul were traded. Ray left on his own, went to the Celtics biggest (and only) Eastern Conference rival, for less money, to sit on the bench and ballsuck Lebron – and shot his way out the door blaming Rondo and Doc. He was also non-existent during the 2008 playoffs until halfway through game 6 of the Finals when they were already ahead by 25 points. Posey deserves to have his number retired before Ray does.

    • eddysamson

      Ray was also suspiciously non-existent for the 2012 ECF vs the Heat. This being after his career high 3pt % over the course of the season. He bricked SO. MANY. SHOTS. Then left for the same team 2-3 weeks later? Mad sketchy.

      • Jake Gruber

        Haha he lost his chance for another ring on purpose?

    • RedsLoveChild

      Good point about Game 6 in 2008. Ray did not start raining down 3`s until the Boston lead was 25…but, him beating Sasha Vujacic one-on-one to clinch Game 4 was definitely a sweet memory.

      Ray cost us two games in the 2010 Finals. His 0-13 shooting in the Game 3 loss at home…and when we needed him most, his 3-14 performance in Game 7 {5-14 would have given Boston the title}.

      • KGino

        Ray cost us the 2010 Finals, period. And perk knee.

        • Danno

          Mostly Ray though. He dribbled the damn ball out of bounds off his OWN foot THREE TIMES in the Finals to LOSE a game.

          • Curt Hays

            Remember that if Doc had called a few more plays per game, maybe Ray would’ve been ready for it. It was a change in the game plan to FINALLY give Ray the ball. Doc always called plays for Pierce. It always hurt us to be that predictable and to never use Ray. Back then, Ray could drive to the hole as well as anyone.
            DOC RIVERS cost us that ring.

          • dk

            Here Here! That 4th quarter game management was a f$*%& travesty! If only Doc subs in Nate Robinson and BBD for a minute or two to give Wallace and some of the other guys a quick rest and stop the slow imploding by scoring a basket or two–we would have won. I remember reading somewhere that LA people thought had we increased the lead just a little more 15 or 17 from 13 everyone one would have been deflated and I think the Lakers would have given up. I also think it would have helped us actually trade some baskets and stopped the Lakers from going on their run. Nate was fearless and he would have had the balls to take a shot in that 4th quarter….but not that I think about this all the time or anything

          • Curt Hays

            Not that we don’t remember the moment the game ended and then we cursed at our girlfriend’s mother…and then apologized profusely for being out of our minds…

          • dk

            hahahaha awesome!

        • RedsLoveChild

          If the 2010 Finals were Women`s Skating :

          A. Bynum = Team Tanya Harding
          K. Perkins = Nancy Kerrigan

      • Jake Gruber

        He also won them game 2…

        • RedsLoveChild

          That is true.

    • CFH

      Non-existent against Atlanta and Cleveland, but not against Detroit or L.A. As much as Pierce deserved the Finals MVP, I see where Cedric Maxwell was coming from the other day when he said it could have gone to Ray.

      And he made Sasha Vujacic throw a temper tantrum in game 4, which can never be taken away from him or us. Good times.

  • vitorrrr

    He left as a free agent, thats his choice, not like he had a ETO, ended his contract, left and took less money. HE wanted a ring, and I blame Ainge. How many times, he tried trade Rondo and Allen during their period. How would you like people always saying your name in a trade rumor. I hate miami, buit Allen brang that championship here just as much as the others. Big Three not Big Two.

    • eddysamson

      Every season, every month, every week, almost EVERY SINGLE DAY, Rondo’s name is in the trade rumors. You know what he wants to do? Retire a Celtic. Get out of here with that BS.

      • vitorrrr

        And had Rondo been a FA since then. Stop BS’ing. Rondo will not say anything negative, he knows when the time comes he will have his way. He rejected a extension and will leave if there is a better offer. Ray signed with us and Extended and put in work. Then left for another ring.. Only due to them being the heat, are people butthurt.

        • CFH

          Going to the Heat was a pretty awful thing in sports terms, though. It wasn’t just another team. It was the triple whammy of the team that had just knocked them out of the playoffs after several years of hard fought battles; the team that was not so very much better than the Celtics at the time; and the team that offered him less money and perks.

          When Doc went to the Clippers– for which he has also been criticized– he went to a team that is more punchline than threat historically, that was much better as the Celtics looked to rebuild, and that offered him things the Celtics couldn’t.

          Ray deserved the venom he got for that and for his dumbass “huh? why are you mad at me?” performance in the aftermath.

          It’s not fair to say Rondo will do the same, though as a great philosopher once said, anything is possible. There are things Rondo doesn’t do as well as Ray Allen, but one thing he does better is handle trade rumors. Rondo lets them roll off his back. Ray takes them personally and stresses out, and always did.

          And Rondo gets credit for that.

          Even though I have zero objection if the Celtics retire Ray’s number. Unless the Heat retire it. Ray can’t have it all ways, in 2012 or in perpetuity.

          • vitorrrr

            Ray Signed a 2 year extention on top of his contract. He was loyal for that period and helped bring in a champ. HIS LOYALTY IS TO HIMSELF. From seven years with the bucks and 4 years with seatle.
            He has no loyalty to anyone but himself. He choose to come here. He Helped us win. He signed a extention with us, and when the time was up moved on. For a 36 year old man, now 38, he gotta win as much as he can right now.
            Boston fans should be mad at any Boston Talent that leave. Our Draftee’s. Not a Free Agent who choose to move on, who extended with us and dragged on the hope for 4 years after wining. Most people at that age are done and in no position to get a Ring.

          • CFH

            “Boston fans should not be mad at any Boston talent that leave.”

            Hmm. Would the entity “Boston sports fan” cease to exist if that occurred?

            If we’re being real world rational about things, we shouldn’t care which group of tall multimillionaires puts a large ball through a slightly larger ring more times in 48 minutes.

            Although I do share your admiration for his longevity. It’s a tribute to his tenacity and how well he took care of himself over the course of decades. It’s why Danny Ainge bet on him having something in the tank at 32 when he first joined the Celtics at an age when most elite shooting guards are already falling off a cliff.

          • vitorrrr

            I said “Boston fans should be mad at any Boston Talent that leave. Our Draftee’s.”
            If Rondo leaves, or if PP left, Avery, Sully etc…If our talent, who we cultivated and drafted left, we should be upset. Not someone who after a decade, comes, helps us wins, stays four more years and then moves on with his during FA.

          • CFH

            Sorry, I misread you.

            If Ray was never Boston, then that certainly makes an easy answer for the question about the fate of #20. It has no business even being considered.

            KG decided to make himself Boston retroactively, so he gets his number retired.

            Ray made all kinds of noises about loving it here, his UConn ties, plastering his kid’s picture all over Joslin ads, his wife’s show on local cable, how he had put down roots and was going to stay. So you can see how we thought he’d done a KG and wanted to be considered “Boston talent” regardless of where he was drafted.

            I’ll stick by what I said before: he can’t have it all ways.

    • Danno

      “Brang” – LOL. Yep, he certainly did make a lot of BRANG noises bricking so many shots.

      • vitorrrr

        lol brought, sorry, we use the word a lot here in london >_<

  • Dustin Chapman

    The people that are seriously still feeling bitter about Ray leaving need to just chill. Ray left for 2 reasons – to win a title and security. Look what happened to the entire Celtics core just one year after Ray skipped town. Even Doc is gone. Ray knew what was gonna happen, and he knew that they didn’t have to juice to take down Miami anymore. Obviously it sucks the way he left to go play with the enemy, but had he stayed he would have been miserable about his decision just a few months later.

    • Dustin Chapman

      I will also say that Chuck is kind of watering down Ray’s contributions here. “Replace Ray with a good SG and we would have still won.” How many enormous shots and game-winners did Ray hit while he was here? Probably just as many if not more than Pierce, honestly. He was amazing in the 08 Finals. His leadership was highly valued by everyone. Etc. You can’t just “replace Ray Allen with any good 2-guard” and call it a day…

      • LA Flake

        Yeah but he was also a defensive liability. The C’s were just as good with Tony Allen starting in his absence.

        • Chuck Da buck

          Exactly I think we woulda won more if we had another elite scoring sg who could play some form of defense.

          • Jake Gruber

            Haha ok man. What kind of statement is that? Who was a better scorer that would have fit along side KG and Paul pierce at that time? Kobe Bryant? Yeah, better defender and scorer, but A. Not

        • Dustin Chapman

          Ray actually improved his defense dramatically after coming to Boston. He was never Tony Allen on the ball but he was actually a pretty solid team defender (more important with our schemes), always worked and even did a good job of checking Kobe. Cs were better with Ray Allen on the floor – fact. Put Rondo and TA side-by-side in a 7-game series there is zero spacing and the team loses.

          • LA Flake

            Ray did a lot of good things for us but at the end of the day, he left us to go join forces with our enemy. If your wife or girlfriend leaves you for your bitter rival, would you hang her pictures on the wall to commemorate all that she’s done for you while you were together? F**k Ray Allen.

          • eddysamson

            I say pretty much the same thing, minus the analogy and F YOU part, and I get downvotes. I don’t get it lol.

            Seriously though, this is EXACTLY why I don’t want his # retired and still currently hate him.

          • Danno

            by “improved” you mean, he actually started playing any defense at all…he never played D in Seattle or Millwaukee. and he plays none now in Miami. He hated his time here. He hated Doc. He hated Rondo, and he was jealous of Paul and KG because he wasn’t #1 any more.

          • Jake Gruber

            I don’t know whether the other facts you stated are true or not, and unless you are a Celtic sitting there typing that I don’t think you do either. What I do consider highly unlikely however, would be your last statement. Ray Allen hated not being #1 anymore and winning a championship, so instead he says “let me go to Miami where I can be the #1 guy” with James wade and bosh? Good point man. Good point.

        • Jake Gruber

          This actually is not true. Whatsoever, really. He actually did a decent job on Kobe Bryant if you recall and became a pretty decent help defender. You might be remembering him in his last few months in green but you’re forgetting 3 years and 8 months worth.

          • Curt Hays

            Thank you. Geez.

    • LA Flake

      Ray left because he was pissed off at the Celtics for having tried to deal him year after year. I get that. Ray also didn’t like being benched in favor of Avery Bradley. I understand that, too. But I disagree that we couldn’t compete with the Heat anymore. The C’s were always doomed by injuries more than anything else since 2008. Had Avery been healthy in Ray’s final year, I would’ve bet my bottom dollar on Boston getting past Miami. Had Rondo, Sully & Barbosa been healthy last year, I would’ve bet money on the C’s advancing to the Finals. But Ray decided to jump ship and join the Heat of all teams. That was worse than joining the Lakers because we’re in the same conference and they were our biggest threat. That is just a cardinal sin in my opinion. And Boston should just give #20 to someone else already and put this debate to rest. If he wants his jersey retired, he can ask Pat Riley.

      • Chuck Da buck

        Even if the refs just called that blatant slap in the face on rondo we woulda been up five or something with a minute left instead they got a and one on a d wade kick to garnets nuts that shoulda been a offensive foul that led to them tying the game.we woulda ended up beating them 4 1 or something but that’s the nba for ya. Didnt mean to bring back bad memories but it still gets me heated today.

        • Chuck Da buck

          Actually I think it was a lebron and one or something and the d wade kick gave them the lead. Can’t remember exactly but we were robbed. And in 2010 I think it was game six in the finals where the lakers shot 20 free throws in the fourth quarter.

          • LA Flake

            In 2009 when we started the season something like 30-1, KG’s injury ended our title hopes.
            In 2010, Perk’s injury derailed our chances.
            In 2011, Perk’s trade and Shaq’s injury pretty much ended our title hopes.
            In 2012, Avery Bradley was sorely missed against Miami. SORELY missed.
            In 2013, Rondo, Sully and Barbosa’s injuries ended our season.

            Still, we were right there every year since our last title. And in a pitiful conference, the C’s would be contenders if still had PP and KG.

            I will go to my grave knowing that the C’s should’ve won AT LEAST one, if not two, more titles since 2008.

          • RedsLoveChild

            Spot on as to 2009, 2010, 2011.

            Celts were never “legitimate, true contenders” after the Perk trade.

          • Danno

            And OKC hasn’t been a legitimate contender since the got Perk.

          • Curt Hays

            HAHAHA, c’mon now!

          • RedsLoveChild

            OKC not a legitimate contender?!?

            I`m not saying Perk is Hall Of Fame material…but things were definitely working well when he, KG, Shaq were patrolling the paint in early 2011.

          • Curt Hays

            AT LEAST two more. AT LEAST. We need a support group for this. It pains me at least weekly.

        • KGino

          to this day I won’t watch a Heat game if it doesn’t involve the C’s because of those calls/no-calls ^^^ We had Miami beat in 5!

          • LA Flake

            Yup. Me neither. And Lebron travels just about every time he travels but, of course, no calls. And when he’s not traveling, LBJ is busy flopping. Just awful.

  • MatthewWilding

    Getting your number retired isn’t just about your game, necessarily. It’s also about how much a part of the team you were. Garnett was only here one year, but he’s still talking about the Celtics as an organization all the time. Ray was offered more security and more money here and he walked because of some perceived slight. He was a great member of the team, but he’s not really a “Celtic great.”

  • Chuck Da buck

    We probably win more than one title with another elite shooting guard. Remember ray Allen disappeared in a ton of those series after the championship. I can remember yelling at the tv for him to play a lil bit of defense atleast when his shot was off.

    • WardenOfTheNorth

      Ray did struggle in the first 2 rounds of the 2008 playoffs. In the Finals, he did find his touch. However, Ray was so good, I’m pretty sure we all expected him to make every shot he took. Also, that Bulls series in 2009 was amazing. One of the best ever. Ray was in sniper mode the entire series. He scored 51 pts in Game 6. He wasn’t expected to play lockdown D, like Tony Allen. Ray was money, especially when he needed to be. Hate him or love him. One thing is for sure, there wasn’t anyone in the league like him.

      • Chuck Da buck

        He also disappeared in a lot of 2010 and 2012 and he never played d if his shot was not falling he was a liability and that is a fact if ray is missing he does oohing else to help u win.

      • CFH

        Game 2 of that 2009 Bulls series was the first playoff game I ever saw in person.

        Ray Allen, for the win, over Joakim Noah.

        Perfect.

  • LA Flake

    OT: I love how over 70% of the voters here think PP will be back in green next year. He’s not coming back, folks. Get over it. I love PP to death but we have no room for him on this team. My money is on PP signing a short term deal with the Clips and finishing his career playing for Doc.

    • RedsLoveChild

      Danny Ainge is a realist—not a sentimentalist—Pierce is gone for good.

    • KGino

      lol it’s impossible to click “no” if you love Paul as much as I do. I clicked yes more because i hope he comes back, not cuz I think he will.

      • LA Flake

        Hey, I still get chills when I rewatch his tribute video. And I wish he’d come back and mentor Jabari…oops. I’m jumping the gun here.

        PP will be back though. As our assistant coach/GM.

  • KGino

    NO. GOD NO. I can think of WAY MORE REASONS his number SHOULDN’T be retired than why it should.

    Ask yourself this question… When Ray retires, where will his loyalty lie? I can’t picture him being a LIFETIME celtic like so many of our retired #’s; hanging out at the Garden and offering insight to young upcoming celtics/involved with the C’s in some way… Anyone that enjoys STICKING IT TO THE CELTICS should not be a part of our history. The moment he chose Miami over us he lost his chance. Let the Bucks hang his number, or better yet the Supersonics abandoned building.

    • Jake Gruber

      This is a better point than any other point I’ve read on here. I’m pretty neutral on this, but I’ve had to criticize so many points on here talking about how Ray Allen wasn’t good enough, disappeared, we could have had someone better, etc.

      What YOU stated, and the way you stated it, is the more legitimate reason not to retire someone like Allen’s jersey. Not because he wasn’t good enough, but because it would almost be an insult to KG and pierce, who definitely deserve it, and have clearly showed us how they loved this city and organization as much as we loved them.

    • dk

      Spot on, totally agree–I feel like the whole talk about Ray Allen is really being driven by the talking media heads that have nothing better to do than to play devil’s advocate and drum up controversy. I don’t think KG and his loyalty attitude and skills and intangibles that he possessed is the same as Ray Allen. Ray was a great player and a very good shooter for this Celtics team. But lets also not cheapen the process of retiring a player’s number. A team like the Celtics or the Yankees etc. with rich traditions and history should have very high standards when they retire a player’s number. I think otherwise it waters down the honor. As is I think there are 4-5 people on the list who should not have had their numbers retired– Not to mention that we’re going to run out of numbers soon!

  • adam

    Ray would have been gone by now anyways. But he wouldn’t be on the heat.

  • pierce Hart

    Haha are they just handing out jersey retirements for the sake of it? He was the third option on a team, good guy, good player but not a great. Rondo would deserve it over him for carrying the team 2010 onwards

  • bill_nair

    Until the BKN game I didn’t even think KG would have his number retired. I thought there would be some sorta special recognition for the big 3 as a whole.

    After the Nets game there’s no doubt KG gets his number retired. Ray doesn’t deserve his number retired but atleast some sort of recognition (whatever that is.) He burned his bridge in Boston. It’s unfortunates cause he’s one of my all time favorite players.

  • NE_Celt

    PP is a no brainer of course…he accomplished so much, endured so much, and stood for so much…and did it like the champion he is.

    I can see KG getting his number retired. He was a big impact on the Celtics and the city; his heart and overall drive were contagious to his team and the fans. That’s on top of all the things he did on the court, which were spectacular all by themselves. Normally I wouldn’t think they would retire anyone’s number who hadn’t been for the team for a longer stint; KG was an exception because of all he brought to the table. He fully embraced all that is Celtic…and he still bleeds green…that says something.

    I don’t argue Ray Ray not getting his number retired; he may have been a member of the big three…but all he was was a good shooter. He may have added some leadership role for the team, but it was nowhere near the level of PP and KG…so his impact wasn’t as much. I will give him props though for his involvement in the community, the city should def be thankful for his contributions there.

  • Jester00

    KG nor Ray Allen should not be up there!!!! But I tell you who should 44

  • cal

    I’d retire Antoine’s number before Ray’s