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Trade Ray for Josh Smith? Celtics Fans React

Jay June 21, 2011 Uncategorized 7 Comments

Piggybacking off of the morning dump post earlier (wait, that just sounds wrong on so many levels) I posed a simple, yet loaded question to Celtics fans on Twitter: Would you include Ray Allen in a trade for Josh Smith?  The answers flew in as fast and furious as a Josh Smith fast break dunk, but unlike the results of his dunks, these were hardly definitive.

The genesis of this debate came from Yahoo's Adrian Wojnarowskiwho is one of the best in the NBA reporting business.  So if he says Smith has interest in being a Celtic, well the green radar starts getting a few more blips on the screen.  There are a few things at play here but none bigger than the uncertainty of the new collective bargaining agreement.  So while we all argue and speculate, this trade scenario is based on the assumption that most of the trading rules will remain unchanged when the new CBA is agreed upon.

So would you do it?  Would you drop that bomb on the core of the New Big Three Era that brought about a green Reniessance to Boston?  Remember, Danny Ainge has always said how he told Red Auerbach that he should have traded away one or more members of the original Big Three during the late 80's.  Now it appears he has his chance to make history… or simply replicate it.

 Here is the breakdown of responses:

  • Yes – 10 votes (25.6%)
  • No – 27 votes (69.2%)
  • Undecided – 2 votes (5.1%)

While the majority of Celtics fans want to hold on to Ray Allen, some of the responses were interesting.  Most of the "No" responses were pretty firm and several "Yes" votes were coupled with uncertainty.  Here were some of the responses:

 Stefan

GeeZee 

Marron 

Ianrider 

Andreas 
Many of you preferred to ship Jeff Green and/or Glen Davis instead of Ray Allen.  While that would be ideal, it's not feasible under the current CBA rules without possibly including other players or perhaps a third team.  Either way, the majority of you prefer to hold on to Ray Allen.  Thinking short and long term that is probably the best way to go.

Think of it this way: Do you feel without trading any of the core four (Rondo, Pierce, KG, Ray) that the Celtics have a legit shot of winning banner #18 by making small moves here and there to fill the voids on the roster?  If the answer is yes, then you absolutely hold on to Ray.  Because really, the only goal is to raise a banner, right?  So if you feel that this one final run THIS season is the BEST chance, then don't trade him.

But, (there's always a but) the Celtics traditionally aren't a big free agent destination spot.  Typically, they've built champions through trades and the draft.  Danny Ainge has remained steadfast about maintaining cap flexibility for next summer, with the hope of signing Dwight Howard, or a combination of players.  Trading for Smith would certainly eliminate their flexibility, especially if the new cap number goes down even lower.  In this instance you'd have to be convinced that a Rondo/Smith/Green core would be the future, barring any other major moves.

Ainge doesn't have many vices and to him, having root beer float parties in college qualifies as a great time.  But his one vice is gambling as an NBA GM.  He's told stories about suggesting to Red Auerbach to trade the original Big Three back in the late 1980's during their decline.  He's traded fan (and team) favorite Kendrick Perkins in the middle of a title contending season.  He traded Antoine Walker at the height of his popularity, then traded back for him.  He traded just about all of his assets for Kevin Garnett, and a lot of people might not remember now but there was a large group of C's fans that hated that deal.

He's even admitted as much to dangling Ray during the 2010 February trade deadline but ultimately decided against it.  The point is, he's equally fearless and numb to what outsiders (and insiders) will think.  In his mind, his justification is always that of helping the team's incessant goal of winning a title.

Josh Smith is an intriguing player for many reasons.  He'd be perfect running the floor with Rondo.  His defense is solid for a young player.  But Ray's value on this team, a championship contending team for one more year, cannot be understated.  He's been option #1 so often in close games during this four year run, especially in the playoffs.  Usually, when he's had a great shooting game, the Celtics have won.  He may be old in age, but to me, he didn't look anything close to his age.

My vote for this is no, mainly because the Celtics are still viable contenders for one more year with a few tweaks here and there.  Really, isn't that the goal?  Trading him for Smith would most likely take them down a notch, but if we're getting crazy then maybe Ainge is considering Smith as a possible asset to flip to Orlando for Dwight Howard?  If it's just Ray for Smith and keeping him long term, I'd prefer to keep Ray for one more year.

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  • http://profile.typepad.com/6p01156f5d5008970c Jester00

    I’d get rid of KG before Ray to be honest

  • http://profile.typepad.com/mdsample greenbeand

    sign/trade baby and both draft picks for smith.. and wait for the trade deadline to unload ray and KG.. power moves vs. lateral moves win championships

  • http://profile.typepad.com/frickenwaaaltaaah frickenWaaaltaaah

    Ugh noooooooo, no Josh Smith please.
    Even a straight up Jeff Green for Josh Smith deal is too much of a lateral move. They are too similar, and we already have the guy with the better attitude and work ethic. When you make too many moves, make lateral moves, you disrupt the development of team cohesion and individual player development.
    The problem wasn’t Jeff, the problem was expecting to integrate Jeff so quickly.
    Ray Allen has more left in the tank than Paul and Kevin. If we want value for his expiring contract, then just sign him to a one year extension. Then if he is still good and we’re still contending, sign him to another one year extension.
    Then trade him when it really is time to trade him…instead of throwing him at the first opportunity that comes along. Then he can retire when he’s traded and basically if not literally retire a Celtic.
    If you subtract Ray Allen, even if you add Josh Smith, the C’s are not contenders next year, and wouldn’t have been contenders last year, or the year before even.
    Heck, two years ago Ray for Josh Smith hurts us LESS because we’d still have Tony Allen at least.
    Look at the Mavs beating the Heat. We need more three point shooting, not less.
    Rondo’s shooting is the biggest flaw on the overall team design.
    If Rondo can raise his free throw percentage, improve his shooting from range, and hit open set shot threes, then if the team can stay healthy in the playoffs they can win a title.
    If Rondo has plateaued, then big moves or little moves, it probably won’t matter. However he does it, he’s got to level up or next season is not the year for 18.
    Part of that is acknowledging Rondo’s limits and not expecting him to be at his best no matter how much he plays. They chased too many regular season wins. We need to be a deep team or forget it, and to limit minutes of Rondo so that he is not worn out come playoff time.
    The C’s would have been better off as a more rested team in the 5th seed.
    Heck…maybe playing bench guys a lot more wouldn’t have even cost us that many wins. As Doc played the bench less, their confidence dropped, they lost their developing cohesion, so Doc played the starters even more, making them even more worn down. It was a vicious cycle.

  • http://profile.typepad.com/trsjr91 BleedGreen34

    trade rondo for one great player or two really good players sign delonte and jeff green and sign a decent bench through free agency and this team will win the championchip.

  • http://profile.typepad.com/karibisha Karibisha

    I am an avid Redsarmy reader but I getting saturated with all the trade speculations. In the end Danny does what he does so I think I am going on hiatus for awhile…all due respect to Redsarmy.

  • http://profile.typepad.com/6p01157053529f970b zippittyay

    After thinking about it, Ray Allen is the LAST one of the ‘Big 3′ I would give up in exchange for Josh Smith if I was inclined to acquire him. If we gave up KG, Smith could start there. If we gave up PP, we have Jeff Green who is supposed to be starting material. Is Delonte really ready to step in and be the starting 2? I for one, don’t want to see PP trying to guard shooting guards 10 years younger than he is. I’d rather give them Rondo if they sweetened the deal some…

  • http://profile.typepad.com/rtcoaster Shawncvd

    What sweetening could the Hawks give Boston for Rondo? Unless Ainge can trade Rondo for a top five PG what good is moving him?
    I feel the Celtics need to get young, athletic studs to mix with it’s aging HOF’ers. Assuming Allen + Clipper’s pick for Josh here’s what it would look like.
    Front court KG/JO/Smith
    Wings PP/Green/Delonte
    PG Rondo/Avery/Delonte
    What I like about this core is KG/Truth can mentor Smith/Green respectively. Also this could be a swarming defensive unit. Size and one more SG would be needed but there would still be pieces Ainge could acquire via Draft and MLE. Ironically this team would run into trouble with the team Ray Ray is traded to. PP would get so tired chasing around Allen.